america; the land of the free and the broke
 

with all this talk of a $700 billion bailout all i have to say is why should i have to pay for the irresponsible bankers who gave out loans to those who should have never got a loan to begin with. now the president want to give the banks that are going under more money so they can give out more loans.

i'm not wall street expect but it seems to be that that what got us in this mess in the first place. you maybe thinking, "what do you mean us?". the $700 billion will come out of any and every tax payers pocket. so just because someone thought it was a good idea to give out money with out all the stipulations that would normally make them ineligible, now we're having to pick up the bill.

oh but that's not all the ceo's of these banks are out of a job but are also going home with several million dollars as a reward for their troubles. so in short enjoy it while you can because it's all down hill from here.

Permission to reply when I wake up, sir!

I'm way too tired to type about this, but just reading, I can tell that this is going to be awesome and you already have some good points.

-Dave

yeah i'm too out of it to post any more right now too. go to bed stig it's like 3 am in ga right now.

A lot of representatives of congress are getting angry phone calls from their constituents on this matter. Call or email your representative and tell them how you feel about this. I did. This is a horrible way to fix a problem.

Here is an email sent out by the Ron Paul headquarters that I received:

Dear Friends,
Whenever a Great Bipartisan Consensus is announced, and a compliant media assures everyone that the wondrous actions of our wise leaders are being taken for our own good, you can know with absolute certainty that disaster is about to strike.
The events of the past week are no exception.
The bailout package that is about to be rammed down Congress' throat is not just economically foolish. It is downright sinister. It makes a mockery of our Constitution, which our leaders should never again bother pretending is still in effect. It promises the American people a never-ending nightmare of ever-greater debt liabilities they will have to shoulder. Two weeks ago, financial analyst Jim Rogers said the bailout of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac made America more communist than China! "This is welfare for the rich," he said. "This is socialism for the rich. It's bailing out the financiers, the banks, the Wall Streeters."
That describes the current bailout package to a T. And we're being told it's unavoidable.
The claim that the market caused all this is so staggeringly foolish that only politicians and the media could pretend to believe it. But that has become the conventional wisdom, with the desired result that those responsible for the credit bubble and its predictable consequences - predictable, that is, to those who understand sound, Austrian economics - are being let off the hook. The Federal Reserve System is actually positioning itself as the savior, rather than the culprit, in this mess!
• The Treasury Secretary is authorized to purchase up to $700 billion in mortgage-related assets at any one time. That means $700 billion is only the very beginning of what will hit us.
• Financial institutions are "designated as financial agents of the Government." This is the New Deal to end all New Deals.
• Then there's this: "Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency." Translation: the Secretary can buy up whatever junk debt he wants to, burden the American people with it, and be subject to no one in the process.
There goes your country.
Even some so-called free-market economists are calling all this "sadly necessary." Sad, yes. Necessary? Don't make me laugh.
Our one-party system is complicit in yet another crime against the American people. The two major party candidates for president themselves initially indicated their strong support for bailouts of this kind - another example of the big choice we're supposedly presented with this November: yes or yes. Now, with a backlash brewing, they're not quite sure what their views are. A sad display, really.
Although the present bailout package is almost certainly not the end of the political atrocities we'll witness in connection with the crisis, time is short. Congress may vote as soon as tomorrow. With a Rasmussen poll finding support for the bailout at an anemic seven percent, some members of Congress are afraid to vote for it. Call them! Let them hear from you! Tell them you will never vote for anyone who supports this atrocity.
The issue boils down to this: do we care about freedom? Do we care about responsibility and accountability? Do we care that our government and media have been bought and paid for? Do we care that average Americans are about to be looted in order to subsidize the fattest of cats on Wall Street and in government? Do we care?
When the chips are down, will we stand up and fight, even if it means standing up against every stripe of fashionable opinion in politics and the media?
Times like these have a way of telling us what kind of a people we are, and what kind of country we shall be.
In liberty,
Ron Paul
________________________________________
Political Advertisement paid for by Committee to Re-Elect Ron Paul

pffffff

time to invest yaaa baby yaaa


not

ill invest in drifting and myself....

the worst part of it all imo is that the big banks are getting off easy but small businesses go under all the time w/o any government aid.

but it's investment you're interested in then go with precious metals and short term cds. i have yet to buy any gold or silver but i've been investing in cds for some time now. the rewards are minimal but the risks are virtually non existent.

i'm so upset that i'm half tempted to use capital letters and exclamation points.

Gold - I've already invested in, waiting for it to hit $950-$1000 and i'm selling
Invest now in Banks that are being helped by government, forgot which bank exactly, but my old mans investing in it tomorrow, their shares were selling for $46 a share, and then when the government bailed them out, their shares were selling $1.46 each share, now they are selling for $3.20, buy a **** load of that, by January, it will be near $10 a share.

i just heard on the radio on my way home the news and i for one am glad. form what i heard it was for the most part conservative republicans and liberal democrats the opposed the bailout. the funny thing is that rather than wounder why it was that party members opposed the bail out they just blamed the other side for it's failure.

what was a bit discomforting though was that the desecrates that i heard seemed to have a vendetta against the currant administration. one blamed the current state of the nation on poor management of the budget and said that president bush and his administration have been failures form the beginning.

i won't agree that point one way or another but it just seems that their motives were not in the nations best interest but rather trying to get back at the president. some were almost to the point of crying because of the failed bailout. i'm not saying i don't feel bad for those that will lose their houses, jobs and what not. but anyone of those making all the nose in favor for this proposal want to do something about it why not take a pay cut and put the rest in some sort of fund.

the one i blame are the people who applied for the loans and the banks for giving them out. so let them deal with it and leave the rest of us out. i still remember about 2 years ago when i heard on some radio program about the great opportunities that would come from offering interest only loans and adjustable rates. i've never claimed to be any expert of any sort but i can spot a bad idea when i see one.

i also blame the bankruptcy laws and such. at work quite a few guys have filed for bankruptcy protection or are in the process. i drive my 2000 jetta and have a modest lifestyle yet they have suvs with +20" wheels or the like and party just about every weekend because they now they can latter get out of the loans. one guy racked up $150k and brags about not having to pay any of it. another is getting food stamps because he can't feed his family but drives a crown vic with 20s.

ok i'm getting a little upset so i'll go hit my punching bag for a while.

i just want to pay off all my debts and take all of my money out of the bank, i think thats the safest thing to do at this point...

Well, the tank went down to E yesterday with the Low Fuel Light On . . .not sure how many gallons that leaves, but when you live in Douglasville and have to drive 10+ miles to get to a gas station (especially since most of them don't have gasoline) you start shaking a bit . . .

I honestly didn't think my baby would make it . . .but she did . . .haha . . she did . . .

-Dave

the administration primarily wants a blank check to "fix" the economy. If I read correctly, the legislation would allow them to do this again, without needing anyone's approval or having to explain to anyone why they're doing what they're doing.

This "crisis" simply shows how ridiculous our economy is. Out of money? Print some more!

I say a big way to help stimulate the economy is to cease and put a legal halt on out sourcing . . .sorry India . . love your food and your women, but you can't have our jobs . . .

Put more Americans back in office buildings, that'll help a ton! I don't care who disagrees with me on this one, I know I'm right. The Chinese, Indians, Koreans, however may have you, are taking our jobs . . .GOOD JOBS simply because they're willing to work for 2.15 an hour as opposed to 18. My company alone has laid off more than 60 percent of some of it's office buildings due to out sourcing, then they put some terrorist in charge of all of it.

Sorry . . ./rant

-Dave

Perhaps I miss read, but what does out sourcing have to do with the financial crisis? I mean I'll admit it may of played an extremely minor part in causing this "crisis". I don't understand how you're relating the two.

I sure hope that as a poor attempt at humor.

What I'm saying is that in order to get money back into the country you have to first put money IN the country. It's almost the same as me saying "Taking trucks with more than 6 wheels off the road will improve traffic flow." I'm not relating to anything else, other than traffic flow. But I digress.

What I feel and from what I've seen, outsourcing is double edge sword that's cutting deeper into us than into anything else every time we swing it. I mean, on the one hand it's cheaper for business to run if they pay WhosYourDaddy from Mumbai whatever he makes instead of paying us. But at the same time, it's putting a huge cut into others spending. Outsourcing has been responsible for a LOT of layoffs recently, and (as I've stated) while it may be beneficial to the company, the employees are now left to front the difference. Not everyone can just turn around, pick up pay and start replenishing their funds right away. This happens to a lot of people. I lost a job to out sourcing . . .more than once . . .because your boy from Mumbai can answer phones and tell someone to reset their modem for a lot less than I can.

I laughed . . .:freak:

racism at it's finest?

If you look at the root cause of the mortgage crisis, you will find out that it stemmed from the Clinton administration. How?

Clinton signed in a bill at the end of his second term that basically told banks: either you meet this quota of approving loans to certain ethnic groups in this country, or we will impose higher taxes and penalize you for not meeting the annual quota enacted within this bill.

So how can banks approve loans, when knowingly, most of those people could not afford loans period? You start playing with adjustable loans and play with figures to allow them to get into the loan for the home in hopes that they will flip the house and get a better home with the equity they made from the previous.

Well, some of them did this which of course jacked up the prices causing over inflation of the mortgage values. Others just bought the homes thinking "I can buy a $500,000 home for $1700 a MONTH! I CAN AFFORD THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Then you start to see people not being able to make payments, small part because of what Dave pointed out, out sourcing of vital jobs that kept our country moving. Others just couldnt keep up with their adjustables once the Feds raised the interest rates. Not to mention home builders kept blowing off signs of a slowing housing market (creating an inventory of unsold homes on the market)

In comes the waves of people who are applying for another home while their current home begins to go under. Thus causing foreclosure rates to skyrocket. And now Wall Street feels the pinch and are now crying fowl over their screw up. The housing market was created to "stem" off the IT stock failure from the late 90's, which again was government stepping in. Had they left this alone back then, we would be fine today. The economy is "healthy" when the market goes up and down. Prevent the economy from going down, market keeps going up. Eventually, the market will have to come back down and I dont know about you, but I rather like to see a small drop, then a drop from where we are now. Granted many "fear" this will cause a depression... that line just sounds like bs to me. Monday's "stock drop" of nearly 800 points is NOTHING. it equates to 9%. In order for us to go into a depression, you would have to see the market drop 3 times more in one day to see a depression begin.

This market will hurt us overall in the beginning, but we need it to happen badly to help the market weed out the bad people and bad investments. The low market will bring out entreprenures (spelling?) and help this economy get back on its feet with new inventions, technology etc. Letting the government do this will only prevent us from moving forward and keep the idiots of Wall Street happy. As mentioned above, it will only burden us as tax payers.

My ranting is done for now... LOL

This isn't about Americans not having money to purchase goods or services, it's about bad business from large companies and people over extending themselves on home loans.

A lot of this is the like the war on terror. "fear fear fear." Quite frankly. Everyone saw the immediate gains, and didn't try to limit growth.

One day I'm for Government regulations, the next day I'm not. I don't think either way is correct.

What we need are smart leaders, and not greedy politicians. I mean we have failing leadership in every sector of our economy starting at the very top, the weak and lying George Bush. I mean his word is worth so little, it may of been the reason no one wants this bail out. Everyone (including me) believes he's crying wolf, and trying to save his fat cat friends.

Why can't we loan the money to these banks and force them to pay us, the US citizen back? Why don't we the American citizen get a piece of the company since we're spending the money to save it?

Because in that case, they would no longer have "free enterprise" they would have to pay us back in the long run.

But the government giving them money is perfectly fine under "free enterprise" because they are entitled to it.

Fear is one thing, but trying to indirectly tell people you ****ed up and expect them to flip the bill? Im sorry, but I dont have the patience to hear a grown man cry about how he mismanaged millions, let alone BILLIONS of dollars and is now asking me to fork my own tax monies out to let him stay sittin' pretty.